The following interview is a conversation we had with Eden Full Goh, Founder of Mobot, on our podcast Category Visionaries. You can view the full episode here: Over $17 Million Raised to Power the Future of Mobile App Testing

Eden Full Goh
Thanks for having me on the podcast, Brett. 

Brett
Yeah, no problem. So, before I begin talking about what you’re building, can we just start with a quick summary of who you are and a bit more about your background? 

Eden Full Goh
Yeah. My name is Eden. I’m the Founder and CEO at Mobot. We are a 45 person startup that’s based in New York. What we’re building is a mechanical robot that will actually automate testing of iOS android applications. And this will enable software engineering teams to be able to ship their releases to the App Store and Google Play faster. So our long term vision around Mobot is that we believe that software is becoming increasingly physical the way that humans are actually using products in the real world. It is changing. It requires push notifications, interacting with other applications, interacting with wearables and IoT devices and hardware. And so we’re really trying to build physical testing infrastructure that will enable more realistic, continuous testing when an engineer is writing code and trying to make sure that it satisfies the intended product specification. And so it’s been an exciting journey so far. 

Eden Full Goh
I’ve been running the company for about five years, and I was inspired to start the company because of my own personal experiences struggling with testing. As a product manager. There was just no readily available solution that would solve the problem exactly the way that I needed it as a product manager at the time. And I had to do a ton of manual testing. We’re talking literal iPads, iPhones, android devices sprawled all over my desk. And I would have to manually use my fingers and just tap through all of these different screens. And it was just such a high friction, laborious and kind of repetitive task. And I had to do it every week in order to make sure that there were no changes, no bugs that would slip through the cracks. And so that challenge really got me so frustrated that I ultimately decided to start a company around it. 

Eden Full Goh
And I think the fundamental challenge remains the same, because technology continues to get more complex. 

Brett
Wow. So I have a lot of questions there that I want to ask about Mobot, but I’d love to learn a little bit more about your background and a few questions just to better understand what makes you tick as an entrepreneur. So first one is, I see on LinkedIn that you were a field fellow, and if I have that program correct, does Peter Thiel pay you or did he pay $100,000 to drop out of college? Do I have that right?

Eden Full Goh
He did, yes. So I was one of the first Teal Fellows in 2011 when they first started the program. And at the time, it was kind of an experiment, right? I think it got a lot of press attention, and I think it was a really interesting idea. Like, if you pay a group of kids over two years $100,000, so just remember that’s $50,000 a year, which is not a super crazy luxurious salary, but it’s enough if you’re a 20 year old, you’re a 19 year old, and you’re just getting started in the industry, you’re just getting ready to grow your career. That’s enough money to quit college, pursue something full time for two years. And I think it really take a note of us, the confidence and the freedom to actually pursue a lot of our ideas. And so my idea was starting a nonprofit around a technology that I had developed in college that would enable solar panels to rotate to follow the sun more efficiently without using any electricity. 

Eden Full Goh
And this would be super helpful in augmenting energy collection in developing countries. So that was my project. During the Teal Fellowship, there were other people who wanted to do asteroid mining, or they wanted to start a biotech VC fund, or they were going to start a traditional tech startup. There were a lot of different founders there as well. And I think just like that opportunity to drop out of college, move to the San Francisco Bay Area, and get all of this exposure to interesting technology, interesting founders personalities, that was really eye opening for me at the time, and I think it really was a formative experience that led to me starting Mobot today.

Brett
And what were those conversations like with your family and friends when you were at Princeton and you were considering dropping out? What was going on in those conversations? And what was going on in your internal conversations, in your head? Was that a scary thing to do? 

Eden Full Goh
I think the nice thing about life is nothing is ever permanent. And so when I pitched this to my friends and family, I didn’t tell people it was a permanent decision to drop out of college. I made sure to kind of tell everyone, hey, I’m just taking a two year leave of absence. Who knows what the future brings? But I got this exciting opportunity, and it’s funded. So financially, I’m going to be okay. I know what I’m going to be working on. And so I think it was a bit of an awkward conversation with my parents, I will say that. But I also think the reason that it all kind of manifested and the fact that it was like a curated program. The Teal foundation was running it. They were going to do quarterly check ins. There were social events that were being organized. I was going to be assigned to different mentors and advisors in the program. 

Eden Full Goh
It almost felt like sort of a different kind of graduate school or fellowship that normally I think academics pursue. And so when I sort of explained it in that way, of course my parents were worried. They were nervous. They weren’t sure what to expect, and there were lots of questions and lots of late night conversations around it. But ultimately, I think it felt a lot less scary because I wasn’t just, like, going off into my own and just kind of doing an unstructured program. There was this opportunity, and I did have to go through an application process, and I wrote essays and everything. And so I think because with these sorts of plans, if you show what your strategy is going to be, it’s almost like having a business plan. You just need to reassure people that you have a path forward and you’ll be able to get their support. 

Brett
Makes a lot of sense. And yeah, it’s not like you were dropping out of college to go live in Bali and go travel the world. This is a very well structured program from a very well known entrepreneur as well. 

Eden Full Goh
Yeah. And so I think ultimately, everyone kind of goes through their own journey in becoming a Founder and kind of finding their life path, finding their career path, and also just personally figuring out their identity and their values. And I think for me, the Teal Fellowship was kind of the first time that I really stepped outside of the box, stepped outside of just like, elementary school, middle school, high school, college, and then actually realized, like, actually, there’s a lot to the world. I can pick my own career path. The major that I chose in college, it’s okay to change gears. I think it really just opened a lot of doors for me and helped me realize that the most important thing is I have to be willing to explore, willing to experiment, and then if something doesn’t work, you have to pull back, don’t just kind of blindly follow the path. 

Eden Full Goh
And I think that’s really important. 

Brett
And it was the nonprofit sun saluter. Do I have that name right? 

Eden Full Goh
That’s right, yes. So at the time this is more than ten years ago, solar panels in developing countries, or solar panels in general, were just a lot more expensive than they are today. I think with the cost of solar and renewable energy and how it’s changed in the last decade, it no longer needs sort of like, small technologies that will optimize an individual solar panel. But at the time, especially in some of the developing countries that I worked in, I had done a summer internship in kenya and Uganda. And I had learned a lot about just how renewable energy and solar energy in some of these remote and rural villages, it was not as accessible to them, and they would use it for charging lanterns and cell phones. And so in learning about some of those communities, I realized that really, you need to be able to squeeze every drop of electricity that you can get out of these systems. 

Eden Full Goh
And so if you can build a $10 water clock mechanism that would automatically rotate a solar panel to follow the sun, and it would generate 20% to 30% more electricity for you, that was a meaningful difference that would make sense in a lot of these communities. And so I started a nonprofit organization to really mobilize the accessibility of this technology open source. It develop educational content, partner with local organizations to run workshops. And so all of this was a really interesting experience for me. Running a nonprofit, at least the kind of nonprofit I was running, required a lot of grant writing, fundraising, hiring local staff, building partnerships. It was a very operational role. And even though I had built the original technology as a mechanical engineering student in college, I ultimately realized that I was getting further and further away from my passion around product and engineering. 

Eden Full Goh
And so running a nonprofit was a really formative experience for me as a Founder. But I realized that wasn’t the kind of Founder that I wanted to be. And so a few years later, after the cost of energy had really started to change, I realized that was a natural transition point for me, where I could then pivot and really learn more about myself and build a career for myself, travel a lot less for me. I get very homesick. So I wanted to just put down roots somewhere. I ended up moving to New York and then handed off a lot of the day to day operations to local partners and just open sourced a lot of the content widely so that anyone on the Internet, even today, you can go online and find a tutorial video of how to build a sunsoluter solar panel rotator. I don’t know how useful it is anymore, given how much solar has changed, but fundamentally, I think that was my very first experience building a product and getting it to market in a number of different ways. 

Eden Full Goh
And so I’m very grateful for that experience. 

Brett
Yeah, that sounds like such an incredible learning experience. Now, two quick questions we like to ask just to better understand what makes you tick. First one, what CEO do you admire the most and what do you admire about them? 

Eden Full Goh
Yeah. So I really admire Edith Harbog. She’s the CEO and Founder of Launch Darkly. I think just to see a fellow woman working in DevOps. She is someone who this was like a decade ago, when feature flagging on different software applications was just not as common of a principle that would be used by software engineers. And it seems obvious now in 2023, we’re like duh. Everyone uses feature flags. But when Launch Darkly first came out, there was a lot of behavior change and convincing engineers, convincing end users that Launch Darkly had to do. And so I think I really admire someone who can build a company that inspires and sparks behavior change. It really changed the way that people think about the software development lifecycle changes the way that people think about developer operations. And I think that has inspired a lot of other companies, a lot of other movements, open source technologies, libraries, frameworks in that ecosystem. 

Eden Full Goh
And so that’s the kind of impact that I would love our company to be able to have one day. And just seeing her execute on that vision and the way that she scaled the business to what it is today is honestly incredible. 

Brett
Nice. That’s such a good call out. I see their billboards all over San Francisco. I feel like they’ve just blanketed the city lately. 

Eden Full Goh
Yeah, I think one thing that I also just love is Launch Darkly. And Edith, the Founder, has just this incredible conviction of just like, this is what they believe in. This is what she believes as a Founder and their culture, and just like being unapologetic about that. Because I do think sometimes in this world, you listen to customers, you listen to investors, you listen to end users, other people in the industry, naysayers messages get murky. And I think one thing that is really important as a company is you have to believe in what you’re building, even if it’s controversial, even if it seems unintuitive and weird. And I think just like really following through on that and then being able to execute from a product sales, engineering, marketing perspective, customer success perspective, to really deliver real, tangible behavior change in the industry. That is amazing. 

Brett
Yeah, absolutely. Couldn’t agree more. Now, what about books? Is there a specific book that’s had a major impact on you as a Founder? And this can be a typical business book or a personal book that’s really just influenced how you view the world. 

Eden Full Goh
This is going to sound so corny because I feel like this is every personal development nerd’s favorite book, but it’s Atomic Habits by James Clear. And I think for me, that idea of 1% improvement every day, if you have a small habit that you do a little bit of every single day, you start with something as simple. They always use that classic example of like, flossing one tooth every day. And if you floss one tooth, you’re like, oh, well, I’m already there. I might as well floss the second tooth, or whatever it is. I think that concept of improving something 1% just doing a little bit and having that compound. And if you do something 1% better every day for 365 days in a year, that is 37 X improvement in a year. And if you don’t and you get 1% worse, the compounding of getting worse is also very significant. 

Eden Full Goh
And so I think personally there’s a lot of habits that I’ve built in my own self development, my own identity, making sure that I have work life balance, some of my own hobbies around music and making sure I prioritize around that. That’s been really formative for me there. But then also professionally, in our business, I think 1% better every day has kind of become a motto for us, where every day we make something about the business better, like something that’s not efficient enough. Or. Oh, this process used to be on Slack. Let’s move it into a task tracker like Jira. Or we need to make a checklist to make sure that we’re following the same SOP or standard operating procedure every time. So I think those kinds of improvements, if you try to do all of them at once, right, you try to wake up at  A.m. 

Eden Full Goh
And meditate every day and journal and then also eat really healthy. If you try to make too many changes to your life in a business or personally all at the same time, it’s overwhelming and it falls apart after a few days and it doesn’t stick. But I think one thing that is really compelling is if as a business you iterate on something every single day. You call out one thing, you want to improve and you make that better and then tomorrow you move on to something else. Our team keeps a backlog of different improvements that we want to make. I think that is ultimately what leads to compounding success over time, but it also requires acknowledging that you want something to improve and knowing that not everything needs to be done and it doesn’t need to be big, dramatic, sweeping things. So I think that’s something that I really embrace about that Atomic Habits motto and mantra is that it really helps with that. 

Brett
Yeah, it’s such a great book and I think I stole this from someone else, or I definitely stole this from someone else, but they call them a Quake book. So a book that just really rocks how you think about the world. Atomic Habits is my number one book for that. When I first read that back in, I think it was like 2018, it just made me completely change how I view habit building. And that’s had an impact, of course, on the personal life, but also on business. As you were just saying, all of those lessons that James Clear teaches and all of the best practices and tips for habit formation, it really does cross over perfectly to business as well. So, such a great book and I hope that all the listeners have read it and if not, they need to read it. Such a good book. 

Eden Full Goh
Yeah. And it doesn’t just apply to personal development, right? This is a book that has had impact for us as a business, as a technology startup. And so I do think that’s something that I do reflect on sometimes is what are other habits, best practices, mindsets that have been effective for me personally, and how can I apply them to the business and also use that as an opportunity to motivate and inspire some of our other team members who are on the team? And especially as we’ve been growing our company, we’re 45 people now. That kind of culture is hard to translate. It’s just like, here’s a PowerPoint presentation with some business principles. I think trying to make it relatable to people on a personal level is really helpful. And something as simple as this 1% improvement concept every day really goes a long way. 

Brett
Yeah, absolutely. All right, now let’s switch gears and let’s dive deeper into the company. So I know you touched on that at the start of the interview and telling us a bit more about the product. So let’s just maybe start with talking a bit more about the status quo. So if someone wanted to go out and do mobile testing now, what are their options? What’s that landscape look like of options they can pursue? 

Eden Full Goh
Yeah, so how the mobile development process works right now is you usually have a software engineering team that will build and they’ll write some code and they’ll improve their mobile app. And they usually do this on a semi regular basis, which is why every week you probably see like, Uber or DoorDash or some of the popular apps that you’re using. They constantly need to be updated in the App Store in Google Play, and then you need to upgrade them to your phone as a consumer. So that process means that engineering team has shipped new code. And before that app is actually distributed to the App Store, it’s normally undergone a testing process. The first part of that testing process is usually a suite of automated unit tests, API tests, integration tests that will run that software engineers as they’re writing the code, they also write these small tests. 

Eden Full Goh
But then there’s also generally a process where you go through a lot of manual testing on different iOS android devices. Tablets, portrait mode and landscape mode, dark mode and light mode, all sorts of different Android manufacturers, whether it’s Samsung or Huawei or Motorola or LG or Google Pixel. There are so many out there. And then you also have all these different iOS versions as well. You have iOS 15 and 16, and in the future we’re going to have iOS 17. And especially if it’s out in developer beta or public beta, there’s always going to be new versions of all these different hardware platforms that are going to come out. And five to ten years ago, it was BlackBerry and Windows Mobile that was all the rage. And now it’s iOS android and who knows in another five to ten years what it’s going to be. 

Eden Full Goh
And so all of this complexity makes it so that to really make sure that your app, when you’re releasing to the App Store in Google Play that your app works exactly like expected, you have to do manual testing. Because a lot of the testing frameworks out there right now, they don’t really cover realistic test cases that reflect exactly the way that an app behaves on a real physical phone. This can be everything from uploading an image when you capture it with your front or your rear camera of your phone. That is actually a really hard process. For example, like verifying your identity with your passport or depositing a check at a bank on the banking app can be hard to automate with software because it requires the real camera, a real lighting sensor, a real graphics card, a real memory card. And there’s also test cases like location services or Bluetooth, or push notifications, or even just backgrounding the app and waiting for data to sync to Apple Health. 

Eden Full Goh
Those are all test cases that have been historically very difficult to automate with software. And so fundamentally, the problem that not a lot of people tend to talk about is that mobile testing is really different from the world of desktop and web application testing. In those environments, you can usually use tools like RPA, Selenium, Cyprus, those kinds of web testing frameworks to really enable automated testing in the cloud. But for something like mobile, it’s just never worked as well. And so what ends up happening is you have a lot of iOS android and QA teams at all of these technology companies that end up having either a bunch of phones or they have some sort of crowdsourced. Process where they have a lot of humans that are just banging away on apps to make sure that stuff works before you release it. And so really the problem that we’re trying to solve is we’re not trying to replace any of the automated testing that goes on. 

Eden Full Goh
We’re trying to augment and reduce the amount of manual testing, manual labor that is still shockingly prevalent in the mobile release and mobile development process at a lot of these software companies. 

Brett
And when we’re looking at these robots, where are they? Are they in New York City? Because real estate is probably not very cheap there in New York City. So where do you actually house the robots that are doing the actual testing? 

Eden Full Goh
So Mobot is building an infrastructure as a service platform. So that means one day in the future we’re going to have warehouses of robots all over the world that are just testing on different apps with different iOS android and different hardware platforms available for testing today. Because we are a startup that’s in R and D, it’s very advantageous for us to keep things centralized. And our company is based in New york. We actually also don’t need that many robots to service a lot of customers. This is something that we’re going to continue to scale out. But I think a misconception is also that these robots take up a lot of space or they’re very expensive. That’s actually not the case. The robots, they sit on a table, they’re desktop, so we can actually stack them on shelves. And then as well, we build our own robots internally so that we’re able to manage the costs. 

Eden Full Goh
And so this makes it so that we can actually sort of keep everything in house in a very compact and efficient way. But then of course, one day in the future we will start to spread out to other geographical locations. But one of the things is that right now all of our robots are in New York because that way it really promotes innovation. Our engineers, our operators, our operations team, customer success managers can all have access and see the robots. And this makes it easier for collaboration so we can improve the technology. 

Brett
That makes a lot of sense. And I see on your website some really impressive logos. So you have Citizen there, you have Be Real, which is of course blowing up now or seems to be blowing up everywhere. What were we able to do to land these logos and how were we able to build trust early on as a startup? Because that’s something that all startups struggle with in the early days. 

Eden Full Goh
So I think building trust is something that is an ongoing process. You don’t just get trust from day one and then that’s it. I think it is really important to grow over time. And so we take an approach where a lot of our customers will kind of kick off with a pilot engagement with us. And during that pilot we’re asking them about their metrics for success. What are they hoping for, what are the time savings, the opportunities that they’re hoping to unlock, the device coverage, the test case coverage that they’re looking to unlock. And so that is something that we build as part of an ongoing partnership and relationship with these companies. And in landing these customers, I think the important point is to kind of make sure that you’re solving a real problem. And I think a lot of why were able to land those early customers is when I directly talked to product managers at Citizen, Product Managers QA, managers at B Reel and other companies like that, I knew how to relate to them because I had personally experienced this pain working as a product manager very adjacent and very close to engineers myself. 

Eden Full Goh
And so I was speaking their language. I was able to refer to technology and processes as they were doing it as well. And so it doesn’t feel like a salesy thing. It doesn’t feel like we’re just sort of parachuting in trying to sell them something. It is a very consultative, very thoughtful conversation. And so I think that’s ultimately what needs to happen is as a startup, you have to know that either from direct personal experience yourself as the Founder that you’re solving a legitimate problem or that you have a lot of access to real customer anecdotes and data to really support the product market fit that you’re looking to hone. 

Brett
And can you talk to me about that process of finding Product Market Fit? What was that journey like for you? 

Eden Full Goh
Yeah, I think you have to as a company continue to find Product market Fit every day. I don’t think it’s like a one and done, that’s it, you checked it off the box and you’re good to go. I think every time something changes in the ecosystem, you have to continue to evolve. Right. The macroeconomic market conditions have changed and so our company needs to iterate iOS 16 came out last year. Apple released some new phones. Samsung released some new phones. We have to be agile and responsive to that. And so Product Market Fit is something you kind of have to continue to evolve on an ongoing basis. And I think in the early days, what was really advantageous is when I was starting the company, I was fresh coming out of the job that I had been working in as a product manager. So I was really in touch with technologies. 

Eden Full Goh
I was really in touch with kind of what was trendy at the time, with what tools iOS android engineers were using, how they would manage their releases, what the pain points were. And so I think that really helped because then I could go into these early interviews and discovery conversations with sales prospects being like, I had this problem at my old job. Is that the same problem that you are currently experiencing? If it is, I started a company and we’re building a solution that will solve that problem. And I think that kind of like being able to say firsthand that this was a problem I had experienced very recently, was very helpful. And then of course, as you gather those responses, they’re going to be like, yeah, I have that problem, or no, actually my problem is slightly differently. This is how we do it. 

Eden Full Goh
Then you use that information to kind of hone your script and adjust your offering. And that feedback is also super critical for honing the product roadmap. 

Brett
And something else I wanted to ask about, so I was playing around in your website earlier before the interview, which I have to say is very well done, you guys have a great website. I love the messaging. But one thing that caught my eye was on the bottom you have the competitor comparison. So it seems like a lot of founders like to pretend they have no competition or they actually believe that they have no competition. So for you, is that something that you had to debate. If you wanted to do that, you versus the other comparisons or how was that decision made internally? 

Eden Full Goh
So even though we at Mobot don’t think we have direct competitors like nobody else right now in the market is building a robotics infrastructure as a service testing company that supports iOS android testing. There are companies that are building robots, there are companies that are building mobile app emulation solutions. There are companies that are building offshore manual testing companies. Those are all indirect competitors and it’s important to acknowledge them. So even though no one is doing exactly what you’re doing, inevitably your prospect, other people, general audience members, they don’t have the context to know why you’re special and you’re unique. So you do have to have content. You do have to have talking points and answers prepared to address and explain your competitors or your so called perceived competitors. And I do this all the time. I get pitched for all sorts of products and as a consumer, I’m scrolling through Instagram and I get ads for stuff all the time. 

Eden Full Goh
And my first reaction is always like, oh, this is something I’ve already seen before, but a different company made it. And I think really it’s so hard these days to come up with something that’s truly novel that no one else has ever pitched before. Every solution, every startup is building upon an idea that probably someone else has already done, but they’re taking a slightly different spin to it. And so I truly do believe every company out there is unique in some way. Right. They have either proprietary technology or proprietary processes or proprietary branding. And so there’s a lot of different things that make a company and a team unique. But of course you have to be able to explain that. And sometimes that first impression is harder to do if you just try to pretend to everyone else that you’re unique because that’s not what they’re thinking. 

Eden Full Goh
And so you do have to design content that supports and challenges their assumptions. And so being able to anticipate their assumptions and objections is actually a really important part of that kind of product discovery and customer discovery process. 

Brett
Yeah, how I like to think about it is don’t just think about how your solution competes directly because of course the solution is always going to be unique, but think about the jobs to be done and how people are trying to complete that job. Think about that comparison and then that’s what the competitor comparison really is. It’s not the solutions that are identical to yours because it’s very easy, I think, to say that there are no identical solutions, right? 

Eden Full Goh
Yeah. 

Brett
Cool. So let’s switch gears here and let’s talk about category creation. So do you view this as a category creation play in the long term or is this really just transforming and reimagining existing market categories? 

Eden Full Goh
I think there’s probably two answers to that. And you could answer this question. Either way. For Mobot, we are solving an existing pain point. Manual testing. Manual labor in the mobile software testing process is an existing problem, an existing pain point that people have. The way that we are solving it is different. We are going to create a different and new way of thinking about physical testing, software testing, being in the physical, real world testing, like how a human would use something that I think is helping us create a new category. But we are solving an existing pain point. And so depending on who you’re talking to and sort of the previous experience and context that they have about the mobile industry or about software development, I will give a different answer depending on sort of the audience’s, different context. 

Brett
Got it makes a lot of sense. And in terms of your go to market challenges, I’m sure you’ve encountered a few of them. If we had to pick one that you overcame, what was that challenge and how did you overcome it? 

Eden Full Goh
I think one of the biggest challenges that we’re in the process of overcoming is the fact that what we’re doing is very different. All of the other solutions out there, they might use real devices, they might use emulation, they are trying to automate mobile tests as well. But we’re the only ones that are using a mechanical robot to do it. And in that way the test results are going to be more reliable, more realistic, we catch more bugs. And that is fundamentally a very different way of doing testing. Sometimes some of the pushback that we get is people are like, why are you using a physical mechanical robot, a hardware solution, to solve a software problem? That seems weird and unintuitive and overkill, right? I think that’s a very common misconception. And the reality is, yeah, in a perfect universe where Apple and Google did not have sort of monopolies on the mobile ecosystem, right now, things might be different. 

Eden Full Goh
If mobile tech stacks were more open source or more mature, maybe we would be able to use software for automating everything. But really the reason why Mobot exists is because the world is becoming more complex. It’s not just this cute little beautiful web browser where you can automate some tests with your UI selector in your Dom and in a web app and then call it a day. You do have to deal with the real world scenarios, like what cell phones are people using? Do they have cellular access or is it WiFi access? Are they offline in airplane mode? Do they have audio and video playing? Are they receiving a phone call while they’re doing something on your app? Is it talking to a home assistant that’s connected via Bluetooth? There is so much complexity. And so I think that’s really one of the things that we’re trying to debunk is that your software is kind of this perfect thing that you can just test in a vacuum. 

Eden Full Goh
We think the real world is complex, and so we really want to encourage that people are thinking about their product development in that way. And I don’t think this is just something for QA professionals. I think this is something for engineers, it’s for product designers, it’s for product managers, it’s for the business professionals that are interacting with product and engineering teams as well. And so I think the biggest challenge that we have is trying to encourage this behavior change and this mindset shift that needs to happen as our world becomes more complex, because it’s not just about simple problems and simple solutions. This is something that really requires a lot of thought. And I also think this idea of one solution that can sort of solve all your problems, I’m just going to have one QA tool for both web and mobile, or I’m going to have one solution that solves both of my iOS android test cases. 

Eden Full Goh
It really doesn’t work like that. I think you have to use the right tool for the right job. And if the world is getting more complex, then the toolkit that you are building as a company needs to also get more complex in order to address those challenges in the world. 

Brett
And last question for you, since I know we’re up on time here, if we zoom out into the future, what’s that three to five year vision look like for us? 

Eden Full Goh
We’d really like to make it as accessible as possible that anyone around the world can just log into the mobot.io platform and be able to connect to a robot live and be able to control that robot and automate testing for exactly their needs. And if we can do that successfully, that means they don’t need to buy a robot and put it in their office or in their house. They don’t need to deal with mechanical maintenance, but they also get realistic testing that integrates well with their code base and integrates well with their existing developer tooling. And I think that would be an amazing win. And so we’re definitely well on our way to working towards that vision right now. We work with over 60 different customers. We mentioned Citizen, we mentioned Be Real, among other different companies that we work with. And we’re already helping them with the solution that we have today for mobile testing. 

Eden Full Goh
I’m looking forward to building a self service version of that platform with more devices, more availability, faster testing results. 

Brett
Amazing. Well, unfortunately, we do have to wrap here before we do. If people want to follow along with your journey as you continue to build, where’s the best place for them to go? 

Eden Full Goh
They can check me out on LinkedIn. I’m Eden Folgo. I’m the Founder and CEO at Mobot. And of course, please do check us out at our website, mobot. IO. There’s a lot of different use cases, scenarios, videos of our robots, that you can check out and just learn more about why physical testing on a real robot is important for iOS android apps, and of course, other sorts of software that require hardware dependencies. We’re looking forward to expanding into other industries over the next few years and so would love to start a conversation with any company or Engineer and QA professional that’s looking to build better products. 

Brett
Awesome. Well, thank you so much for taking the time to share your story and talk about this vision. This is all super exciting and hope to have you back on in a couple of years to talk about everything that’s happened. 

Eden Full Goh
Thanks, Brett. This was great. 

Brett
All right, keep in touch.